The Verifiable Claims Task Force

A Task Force of the Web Payments Interest Group

Verifiable Claims Telecon

Minutes for 2017-05-09

Topic: Agenda Review and Introductions

Matt Stone is scribing.
Agenda, no change
New Members, none

Topic: WG Document Handoff

Dan Burnett: [1] Verifiable Claims Use Cases (CG Final Report)
Dan Burnett: [2] Verifiable Claims Data Model and Representations (CG Final Report)
Dan Burnett: No response on the final documents
Manu Sporny: Published the docuements via minutes last week. we have not objections to date
Manu Sporny: Chairs could use the spec publishing link to finalize
Manu Sporny: The Chairs will use the following link to publish the FCGS:
ACTION: burn to be the chair to work though the publishing process with manu help
Manu still planning to work w/ contributors to release the final IPR

Topic: Joining the VCWG

Dan Burnett: Charter join link is here:
Dan Burnett: Please join the Verifiable Claims Working Group if you plan to participate. This is required to get details for dial-in etc.
Manu Sporny: Calling out any particpants of this call who aren't members.
Manu Sporny: Colleen kennedy, matt larson, work with stonematt to get on the WG
Joe Andrieu: Just submitted the request
Manu Sporny: If you aren't a member, there is an application for "Invited experts" that the chairs will ultimately accept
Manu Sporny: Expectation is that the invited expert has a special skill that the group wants or needs
Dan Burnett: Invited expert page:
Dan Burnett: Other comments?

Topic: Reminder: this is last CG call at this time

Dan Burnett: Next week the dial-in information will be different.
Christopher Allen: Doesn't the email list change as well?
Manu Sporny: Yes, it does
Dan Burnett: Chairs will send dialin info to the WG email group.
Manu Sporny: Old one stays around, though... for the CG to use.
Manu cries 1,000 tears as we transition over to WebEx.
Christopher Allen: -1 Uggh.
Gregg Kellogg: DCMI has moved from WebEx to Zoom.
Logging general discontent re: loss of IRC/SIP

Topic: Open Mic / Community Group Next Steps

WG chairs have completed tasks necessary to transistion. handing off to manu for Open Mic
Manu Sporny: Use Open Mic to discus several items - first up New Leadership
Manu Sporny: Ack ChristopherA for raising his hand for volunteering to be CG chair
Manu Sporny: Have also chatting with Kim Hamilton with BlockCert and Learning Machine - she's interested in co-chairing
Manu Sporny: Kim not present today b/c at an event
Manu Sporny: Have 2, this is an open call for chairs. If we get more than 3, we'll have to elect. open call will stay active through the week
Manu Sporny: Unless others volunteer, new chairs will be ChristopherA and Kim
Christopher Allen: I'm enthusiastic about the broader problem - particularly the discussion about "what is the broader problem?"
Manu Sporny: Tackle scope last....
Manu Sporny: Poll sent out last night about meeting times for CG
Manu Sporny: General desire is to have CG call adjacent to WG (before or after).
Manu Sporny: Poll to meeting times:
Manu Sporny: Please complete the poll, if you have an opinion
Dan Burnett: Suggest keeping WG time as is
Christopher Allen: Both Kim and I prefer the later time
Matt Stone: There wasnt' a vote option for "either works" - should we add that?
Matt Stone: Noticed a couple chose both, but, that's not obvious...
Manu Sporny: If it's even it's the chairs perogative
Manu Sporny: Reminder that WG charter is datamodel and syntax - NOT protocol
Manu Sporny: There are those of us in CG that need protocol
Dave Longley: +1 As protocols and web browser APIs/polyfills and so forth are out of scope for the WG ... we definitely want it in scope for the CG.
Matt Stone: +1 For protocols
Christopher Allen: Original CG charter - discuss, research, prototype and test credential storage for the web....
Christopher Allen: We should take advantage of what the CG can to do publish reports, etc.
Christopher Allen: What is selective disclosure... latest that crypto community offerings, etc
Christopher Allen: Incubate mechanisms to exchange claims
Christopher Allen: If something matures, may submit it to WG for consideration
Christopher Allen: RWoT has DID work that doesn't have a home right now.
Manu Sporny: We've worked hard to create a technology funnel. right now, have people working on bleeding edge at places like RWoT some of which comes into the CG, build support for the work, eventually matures to a WG
Manu Sporny: Could see this work to continue for the next couple of year
Manu Sporny: Presume the next CG work becomes WG 2.0 - continue the funnel.
Manu Sporny: Also have a number of digital signature formats. we're using them in implementations but WG isn't chartered to ratify them
Manu Sporny: Digital Bazaar believes DID is critical to portable claims
Manu Sporny: A detail of DID is that they kindof/sortof require blockchain... we'll need to bring blockchain into this discussion more.
Christopher Allen: I bring is clarity on security and crypto aspects. Kim is a coder, we need active working code. would like to see more prototypes, examples, etc
Christopher Allen: Me too.
Dave Longley: Largely in agreement - would like some browser poly-fill work done quickly - important for adoption
Christopher Allen: Poly-fill is also absolutey w3c
Joe Andrieu: Like everthing that's been said. i joined because i want to give everyone on the planet a legal identity by 2030 - wondering where this fits
Manu Sporny: "It's in scope when people work on it"
Christopher Allen: +1 UN 16.9
Dave Longley: Another item related to protocol/polyfill: a query language for asking for certain types of claims
Joe Andrieu: Want to be sensitive to the pipeline
Dan Burnett: Yeah I thought one of the advantages of verifiable claims was that we didn't have to require identity, only identifiers
Christopher Allen: Recognize there is political sensitivity about this sort of language. in our scope to communicate more effectively about what we mean when we say identity
Manu Sporny: Responding to JoeAndrieu - having pet issues is fine. especially when it results in a rich ecosystem of capabilities
Manu Sporny: There may not be a standard for UN 16.9, but we can make technology that supports that
Adam Migus: +1 To manu's comment about making sure that the charter and work *support* your pet idea as the best way to ensure it's tackled
Manu Sporny: Need to declare to what's NOT in scope. Identity (capital I) is not in scope - too esoteric...
Manu Sporny: We can create technology to solve identity problems, but we're not the Identity Working Group
Dave Longley: +1 Important to keep in mind w3c politics :)
Adam Migus: +1 To that too :-)
Dan Burnett: Yes, not just w3c. The world disagrees on identity as well
Manu Sporny: Should review the CG group name.
Adam Migus: Yep!
Dan Burnett: Naming = bike shed topic ("what color should we paint the bike shed?")
Manu Sporny: As we recharter - it's inevitable that we want to update name
Manu Sporny: Name change may be difficult logistically
Gregg Kellogg: Publishing documents often means the CG is complete.
Dave Longley: Voip-vctf: 47f is Christopher Allen
Manu Sporny: Logistically spinning down one group and spinning up the next requires everyone to rejoin the new group. loose people that way
Dan Burnett: Yes, better to keep the existing group (and name, if necessary) than try to start a new CG
Matt Stone: -1 To starting a new group
Dan Burnett: W3C doesn't care too much about naming of CGs
Dan Burnett: Only WGs
Dave Longley: Probably not worth replacing the group w/ the same people working on generally the same issues isn't worth it

Topic: CG and WG call next week

Dan Burnett: We'll announce times this Friday. chairs of WG still intend to be involved in the CG. WG call is 11am ET on Tuesday
Dan Burnett: Thanks to manu for work to date
Dan Burnett: Adjourn.