Archive index

A11y Slackers Gitter Channel Archive 21st of April 2016

What fresh hell is THIS now? - Patrick Lauke
  1. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 07:29
    Godmorgen slackers.
  2. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 07:30
    o/
  3. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:00
    I'll only mention this once so it's not spammy: the DictationBridge project just launched its Indie GoGo campaign: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/dictationbridge/x/13560037#/
  4. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:00
    It's a project for software that can combine speech recognition with screen readers... some people need both
  5. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:04
    \o/
  6. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:22
    Prrff
  7. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:22
    50$ minimum Oô
  8. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:23
    You're rolling in TPG money anyway ;)
  9. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:23
    You'd think so…
  10. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:25
    Don't forget I fly to London twice a month :P
  11. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:28
    Sure :) priorities =)
  12. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:29
    Don't get me started dude ;)
  13. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:30
    It's not like anyone's required to give the minimum... just like my Run For Kika. Sure, they try to make you think the 27 euros is a bottom default, but under that is "Other" and people have in the past given me 2 cents.
  14. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:30
    (which was silly of them since using iDeal on kika costs 35 cents, lawlz)
  15. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:30
    At least you found a somewhat local girl @MichielBijl, some of us are not that smart
  16. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:31
    ha, local
  17. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:31
    Haha
  18. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:31
    Localler anyway
  19. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:31
    Only 500km.
  20. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:32
    If I had visited Job every weekend... whew
  21. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:37
    Why didn't you, did you not love me!
  22. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:38
    Thanks for the RT @stevefaulkner
  23. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:38
    Ha
  24. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:39
    NVDARemote had good chances in its crowdsourcing because there are highly-paid blind computer professionals who needed it. DB is likely going to have more low-employment, student etc users and probably won't have (m)any corporates.
  25. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:39
    Wonder if I can bully Pearson...
  26. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:39
    I love how Mathilde adds alt text to her tweets <3
  27. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:39
    how does she?
  28. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:40
    or just via the phone?
  29. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:40
    with reply to self.
  30. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:40
    Old fashioned way.
  31. stevefaulkner
    @stevefaulkner
    Apr 21 08:40
    @StommePoes de nada
  32. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:40
    yeah I've done that.
  33. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:40
    And she has Windows Phone, so no alt text in her twitters.
  34. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:40
    Same here, Windows Phone (I just use Twitter mobile web, mostly works fine)
  35. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:40
    Well, point was, she's not in the a11y scene…
  36. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:41
    There might be an app, but I don't app except whatsApp
  37. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:41
    No but she's probably noticed how lots of images don't even show on the phone
  38. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:41
    but the replies, you can see
  39. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:41
    and how could you have not rubbed off on her at least a little bit? :P
  40. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:41
    I thought her ;
  41. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:41
    ;)
  42. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:42
    Or rather, I asked her to do it, and told her why :)
  43. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:42
    First hit of "sitepoint clown balloon" is the captcha post https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/3trGi9yK/
  44. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:42
    This is incognito, so no bubbling
  45. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:44
    alt=search results for “sitepoint clown balloon” on DuckDuckGo https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/OHTbHaD7/Screen%20Shot%202016-04-21%20at%2010.43.45.png
  46. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:44
    Same on truly not bubble mode.
  47. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 08:45
    Haha
  48. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:52
    lawlz
  49. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:52
    I doubt there are many clown-balloon anythings out there, honestly
  50. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:53
    Wow, I stepped over to the Dark Side
  51. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:53
    I accepted an old invitation from my "new" group (UX in Pearson) to Google+, something I've never used, just to spread DB.
  52. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:53
    I told it I was born 1 1 1930.
  53. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:57
    I'm always born at 1-1-1970
  54. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:57
    Easy to remember.
  55. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:58
    Yeah I thought that one would trigger something
  56. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 08:58
    I tend to use that one normally
  57. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:58
    I tried to create an account at facebook called Deve Loper, they said I needed to give out my real name.
  58. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:58
    So I named it Dave Loper.
  59. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:59
    Anyway, how do I donate less than 50$ to the DicationBridge thing?
  60. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 08:59
    Ah, found it!
  61. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 09:00
    For anyone that wants to give to DictationBridge: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/dictationbridge/payments/new
  62. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 09:00
    There you can just give whatever you want.
  63. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 09:00
    No idea but it's usually possible... just make sure there's not like an iDeal-type cost that is more than the donation, that would be silleh
  64. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 09:01
    Not as far as I can see. There is a vinkje you need to uncheck for their newletter.
  65. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 09:01
    Bad IndieGoGo.
  66. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 09:02
    It's kinda too bad it has Susan's name... it should have been like "3 Mouse Tech's"
  67. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 09:04
    Yeah
  68. stevefaulkner
    @stevefaulkner
    Apr 21 10:01
    HTML5Accessibility https://twitter.com/stevefaulkner/status/723032868688031746
  69. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 10:42
    Looks very nice. Wonder if it can count as a non-fugly accessible website...
  70. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 11:26
    Fascinating, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RF_resonant_cavity_thruster
  71. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    ```
  72. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    <meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, initial-scale=1, maximum-scale=1">
  73. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    <!-- Mobile Specific Metas
  74. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    ================================================== -->
  75. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    ```
  76. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 12:07
    wat
  77. mikaelR
    @cr2a-graphique
    Apr 21 13:14
    hi there, did everybody know why screen reader say <out of list> before described a list ?
  78. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 13:16
    I didn't know why. I just assumed it was saying unordered list in a weird computer voice
  79. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 13:20
    I am kind of confused about the HTML5 Accessibility redesign in regards to the buttons in each section. I expected them to have aria-controls and refer to the rows that they control. The aria-pressed part surprised me, but I get it now that I think of it more
  80. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 13:23
    Also, surprised to see a site be mobile-friendly without a meta viewport
  81. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 13:27
    And aXe is complaining about the number of columns being off. I assume this has been tested and is actually fine though. It should be assuming AT does the right thing
  82. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 13:35
    [karlgroves] The number of columns being off? What’s the exact error message?
  83. stevefaulkner
    @stevefaulkner
    Apr 21 13:48
    @powrsurg - note its a preview only still needs further testing (which is why it's in my repo not on html5accessibility.com yet) if you find any issues please file a bug https://github.com/stevefaulkner/HTML5accessibility/issues
  84. dothedesign
    @dothedesign
    Apr 21 13:53
    Off topic, I know, does anyone here feel confident with ng2 and would want to try and work through a problem with me?
  85. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 13:54
    @karlgroves "Table does not have the same number of columns in every row" and "Header cell does not have visible text" for each of the five main regions. In Firefox clicking on the exact element shows it complaining about the Criteria headers
  86. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 13:55
    It bothers me that everybody in this country drives on the wrong side and acts like it's no big deal…
  87. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 14:00
    It also bothers me that Wi-Fi in the bus is so slow.
  88. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 14:00

    [karlgroves] > Table does not have the same number of columns in every row

    I have no polite comments about that issue result.

  89. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 14:02
    I assume the checker isn't noticing the rowspan that is in use?
  90. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 14:04
    I was guessing that was what is going on.
  91. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 14:04
    Nice check :)
  92. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 14:11
    [skerrvy] Does anyone have any user tested best-practices for displaying form errors? We're in the process of trying to rebuild the form controls of a CMS for accessibility purposes and I've been reading endless options online and I can find pros and cons with each one. I understand this is a big topic but any help or advice would be appreciated!
  93. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 14:12
    HTML ASS gets a fill pass from Tenon.
  94. stevefaulkner
    @stevefaulkner
    Apr 21 14:18
    @powrsurg thanks for the bug :clap:
  95. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Apr 21 14:18
    np
  96. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 14:30
    I believe my company tested forms where
    1. the title of the page changed
    2. before/in front of the form was a list of the errors
    3. the errors are links to the problem input
  97. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 14:30
    however I'm pretty sure those results are internal, and I do not know how many variations they tested-- all I was the later "this is how we do errors on forms" and that some year or 3 earlier was tested.
  98. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 14:32
    [skerrvy] Thanks @StommePoes - one of the cases I'm concerned about is if we need to use long forms where the error list is only visible at the top of the page, the error messages could be out of view once the field is in view. I think including inline error messages as well might be overkill, but I can't help but feel we're leaving some people out if we don't do it.
  99. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 14:35
    [skerrvy] I've been wondering if I could attach a tooltip or some text that wont be read by a screenreader (assuming we've attached the listed error message to the input already) to accommodate the sighted users who might not easily associate the listed error with the specific input as they're going through the form.
  100. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:02
    We assume a page refresh
  101. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:02
    meaning the user, and the focus, is brought to the top anyywa
  102. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:02
    however if the form uses AJAX and that is not the case, you have some other options:
  103. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:02
    manually moving focus to a list that is still at the beginning of the form
  104. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:03
    You can indeed combine this with inline error messages: ideally you will at least repeat the error when the user is at the error'd input, instead of relying on them remembering what they read in the list.
    :
  105. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:04
    And, I did it once and recently saw it again! But don't remember where: I had, after each error'd input, a skip link that was invisible until you tabbed (this was before I started testing stuff with screen readers... the version I saw recently just had these links visible all the time), which could jump users to the next input with an error.
  106. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:04
    if it was a very long and complicated form, for sighted keyboarders at least, this saved a lot of tabbing
  107. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:07
    not only errors showing after form submit with page refresh, but what we do at work is also assume a dedicated form page, rather than a page which happens to also have a form (we have those too)
  108. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:09
    [jitendra] Are infinite scroll bad for a11y?
  109. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:10
    [jitendra] mainly infinite scroll on new website
  110. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:11
    It sucks if there's something after the scrolly part, like a footer
  111. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:12
    and if you are in commerce, it may cause "decision paralysis" but that's not really a11y
  112. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:13
    infinite scroll seems to work best when people are not expected to do much more than read.
  113. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:14
    clicking a link and then hitting the back button tends to bring users back to the top of the old page again, meaning they have to scroll all the way back down to regain their place... you could argue that's a problem for cognitive disabilities, if the users expect to end up where they were.
  114. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:14
    [scottohara] heh, was just typing that.
  115. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:16
    Baymard group did a usability (not accessibility) study on pagination, infinite scroll and infinite scroll-but-with-a-more-button... the latter did the best (had the most user engagement and lead more often to sales, which for most businesses was the main success criterea)
  116. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:17
    The More button however can, by itself, solve some of the a11y issues infinite scroll creates.
  117. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:17
    [poorgeek] are the results of that study public?
  118. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:17
    The user has more control, they can skip the button to reach a footer or sidebar if there is one...
  119. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:17
    yes
  120. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:18
    Looks like they published it at Smashing rather than their own blog, but they do that now and then https://www.smashingmagazine.com/2016/03/pagination-infinite-scrolling-load-more-buttons/
  121. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:18
    "Pagination is still the most popular way to load new items on a website because it ships by default in almost every single e-commerce platform. However, our usability test sessions found “Load more” buttons combined with lazy-loading to be a superior implementation, resulting in a more seamless user experience. We found that infinite scrolling can be downright harmful to usability — in particular, for search results and on mobile. However, it’s not black and white, because the performance of each method varies according to the context of the page."
  122. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:20
    [poorgeek] interesting. my assumption would have been that mobile users would have preferred infinite scroll while desktop/web users would have preferred pagination or “load more” methods.
  123. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 15:20
    [poorgeek] but it seems like every one likes Load more the best
  124. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:20
    We were recently, at home, looking through houses for rent. It's similar to e-commerce: lists of houses. Very often we (consumers) want to compare several items that caught our fancy. One of the websites seemed to have deliberately disabled the command+click on the Mac. After a few times of frustratingly trying to open several tabs with chosen houses, we left.
  125. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:21
    Infinite scroll can do two problems: it can eat your browser memory (Jitendra just tweeted this actually), and it can cause the user to not purchase due to too many choices. This was one of the reasons Etsy went from inifinite scroll back to pagination. Amazon too
  126. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:22
    There's a study done by a blind colombia university student? professor? (forgot), where she used jam to show choice paralysis in people.
  127. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:22
    More choices, the less likely one even buys.
  128. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:24
    looks like someone at the Uni goofed with permissions http://elizabethonline.com/blog/the-jam-experiment-on-choice
  129. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 15:28
    Infinite scroll at Etsy http://danwin.com/2013/01/infinite-scroll-fail-etsy/
  130. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 16:02
    V&L show is on now
  131. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 16:06
    https://plus.google.com/events/ca4evjajimgn8hur9ei6r1ja3ao <-- V & L
  132. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 16:08
    mentioning @jkva :P
  133. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 16:10
    Oh no
  134. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 16:12
    Will have to watch later
  135. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 16:32
    Yeah I'll watch the re-run.
  136. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 16:38
    You were called Mitch
  137. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 17:11
    Of course I was…
  138. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 17:11
    Thanks Karl!
  139. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 17:11
    I bet it was Karl…
  140. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 17:17
    [karlgroves] Nope!
  141. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 17:17
    [karlgroves] Not me
  142. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 17:23
    [cordelia] Wondering if Apple bug or if I accidentally turned on a setting somewhere: I recently upgraded to OS X El Capitan, and now in Safari, if I turn on VoiceOver for a bit and then turn it off, I get a little blinking vertical line cursor anywhere I have focus / anywhere I click.
  143. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 17:23
    [jitendra] http://blogs.msdn.com/b/translation/archive/2016/04/20/microsoft-translator-adds-image-translation-to-android.aspx
  144. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 17:24
    [cordelia] I’m guessing bug because if I close and reopen browser, the line no longer appears.
  145. dothedesign
    @dothedesign
    Apr 21 17:27
    so in Plunker, there is a line of code for angular <html ng-app="ui.bootstrap.demo">. the ui.bootstrap.demo, do I need it in my index.html file?
  146. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:05
    @cordelia, I have the same
  147. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:05
    I know Karl does too.
  148. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:05
    No clue why it is.
  149. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:06
    See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUGjvh112sI
  150. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 18:09
    @dothedesign If you want that angular application to govern that page, yes. Which Plunker are we talking aboot?
  151. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 18:12
    I missed a bunch of slacking because my connection kept resetting, lord knows the wisdom I've missed
  152. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 18:24
    @stevefaulkner logged a couple of issues against http://stevefaulkner.github.io/HTML5accessibility/
  153. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:25
    I missed a bunch of slacking because I did actual work.
  154. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 18:26
    Showoff
  155. MichielBijl @MichielBijl prances around like a peacock.
  156. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 18:27
    :D
  157. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:54
    s
  158. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 18:54
    One day, Karl will join a working group at W3C, and we can all call him out for working for W3School
  159. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 18:55
    [karlgroves] lol
  160. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Apr 21 18:59
    haha
  161. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 19:14
    @Karl, I think I've called Shadi shady…
  162. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 19:15
    Karl and Billy “We can announce a couple of speakers…”
  163. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 19:15
    Continue to announce all the speakers…
  164. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:41
    Are there any browsers who act weird where there's an href in an anchor but instead of referenceing text or a hash, it's just an empty string?
  165. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:41
    href="" ?
  166. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:42
    So far I've been able to focus on it in browsers I've checked but I vaguely remember someone having trouble with it
  167. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:42
    also wondering if it's worth it to make one of our applications follow a true tab panel, or just remove all teh tab panel stuff entirely
  168. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:43
    students have already been taught by how it currently works to tab to the tabs with tab key... arrows just spell the words
  169. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:46
    Man, I know people say "don't worry your pretty head about how the HTML looks, browsers don't care" but when I'm trying to diagnose someone's React page announcing weird shizzle in Firefox, yeah, it DOES matter that there's a million nested divs... which React kinda encourages since you can't have HTML in a component that's more than one direct element... so for every componetn with multiple elements, you need to wrap it all in something. Looks like this guy wrapped everything in a span
  170. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:46
    millions of spans
  171. Mallory
    @StommePoes
    Apr 21 19:46
    with bazillions of characters long strings generated by React... ug
  172. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:07
    @StommePoes, Safari handles those fine.
  173. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:07
    As in, anchors without anything in the href.
  174. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 20:07
    From a bit of background reading it might cause a problem with IE7 but of course I have no way of testing that nor do I care if it does ;)
  175. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:08
    jkva has VM's that go back that far.
  176. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 20:08
    but is it worth firing it up to find out :)
  177. jkva @jkva makes the WinXP boot sound
  178. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 20:10
    so I've written a check to see if there are visible headers on a page which are not marked up as headers.....
  179. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 20:12
    basically the logic is as follows
    • Find the text size of every text node on the page
    • get the mean and the standard deviation
    • for every text node which is > (mean+ 1 SD) in size check:
      • is it a child of a header (either H1-6 or role=heading)
      • is it a child of something else that shouldn't be a heading (This is where I need help)
    • if it isn't one of those and it is big then flag as a warning
  180. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 20:13
    what else needs to go in the exclude list... I think button should... big text on buttons probably aren't headings.
  181. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:38
    anchor
  182. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:38
    input type=button
  183. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:38
    Any input really
  184. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:39
    th maybe
  185. Michiel Bijl
    @MichielBijl
    Apr 21 20:39
    Although I haven't seen tables with extremely large ths
  186. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 22:09
    I don't think anchor. I quite often see headings as a child of anchor
  187. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 22:09
    or links that are also acting as headings
  188. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 22:10
    inputs can't really have text children (most of them) so wouldn't really apply there but I get your point.
  189. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Apr 21 22:37
    [jyung] :wave: I got a question about color contrast! To meet the 4.5:1 contrast ratio, a text color needs to be decently dark on a white background. What are some approaches of displaying “muted/secondary text”?
  190. jnurthen
    @jnurthen
    Apr 21 23:54
    smaller? less dark? (but still above 4.5:1) Really depends on what you mean by secondary. If you are displaying text on the screen you want people to be able to read it after all.