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A11y Slackers Gitter Channel Archive 23rd of August 2016

What fresh hell is THIS now? - Patrick Lauke
  1. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 00:03
    [jack_nicolai] @michiel: A color contrast checker would be a must. I’m thinking of two flavors. One, which is like most checkers which allows you to enter a foreground and background color and do the check. Another option would be to select to items, saw a piece of text and a object behind it (assuming it is the background) and run the check. Foreground and background would be determined by stacking order.
  2. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 00:13
    [michiel] Yeah I was thinking the latter too. Some form of automation would be desirable me thinks.
  3. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 00:25
    [ayashi] hey everyone, I'm working on a site that has some animations on certain pages such as video backgrounds for headings, animated gifs, etc. My understanding from reading this: https://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/time-limits-pause.html is that we need to allow the user to stop or pause those items. given that none of this is essential animation, what do you think the best implementation would be? A single link (say, in the header) that pauses or stops all nonessential animation? Or individual controls for each element?
  4. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 00:34
    [michiel] A “reduce motion” checkbox / setting would be best I'd say :)
  5. [jack_nicolai] A global setting would be best considering a person who is looking to change this setting is likely to want to reduce motion on any animation versus a single item. Another thing is to consider the motion rate and only having the animation play once.
  6. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 00:50
    [ayashi] thanks for the input! :) I have to leave work right now but might follow up on this when I get started again in the morning. Thank you!

  7. [karlgroves] @jack_nicolai I wish I had a magic bullet answer to the question but maybe an answer around the goals people might have could help? Typically if doing wireframe reviews we’ll communicate to customers things like focus management; name, state, role, value on controls; keyboard access. It usually depends on the customer but if it is our first engagement with a customer they won’t have much a11y knowledge so we’ll need to be extra-explicit in our guidance.

    All of that being said, I’m not sure this necessitates anything special for accessibility.

  8. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 01:01
    [jack_nicolai] @karlgroves: I think I follow you. At bare minimum the opportunity to add a comment or annotation to an item would at least provide an option for communicating any number of accessibility attributes about an object. I’m thinking about pie-in-the sky options like context aware options to help UX/designers folks who may not remember all of the ARIA off the top of their head, but could make the right choice if it were in a list of options. A goal that has come up is around keyboard tab (or swipe) order. It is so core to different assistive technology and comes up often. In the past, I’ve added used a design tool to overlay numbers on top of a screenshot. This is a tedious task, but is really effective to hand off to a developer. Having a tool where I could specify the order and have it visualized for me would be a big win in my book.
  9. [karlgroves] Yeah. Ideally we’d be able to point devs to an existing style guide reference they can use rather than reinventing the guidance each time
  10. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 01:33
    [jack_nicolai] True. For new projects, screens, widgets, having the ability to quickly annotate keyboard/swipe order would be useful I think.
  11. [karlgroves] I agree.
  12. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 05:18
    [caesar] Is success criteria 2.4.7, Focus Visible, met if the default browser focus is present, BUT isn't visible due to insufficient contrast caused by styling?
  13. luis garcia
    @garcialo
    Aug 23 06:16
    @caesar No, it's not met. Default focus doesn't just give you a pass; it also needs to be discernible no matter how crappily. If it's not visible; it's won't pass.
  14. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 06:20
    [caesar] OK, thanks. I was wondering wether this might be another one of those cases where W3C considers this SC and the Contrast SC as separate and distinct.
  15. luis garcia
    @garcialo
    Aug 23 06:21
    Well, it can be crappy contrast as well and still technically pass. But you said it wasn't visible, so I was going based on that.
  16. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 06:22
    [caesar] Yeah, G149 gives the impression that as long as it's highlighted "in some way" then it passes, nevermind if that way provides sufficient contrast... https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20160317/G149
  17. garcialo @garcialo nods
  18. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 07:17
    [dean] Why do we need one tool to rule them all? When I am upping fidelity and moving towards design I use Sketch and Invision to put the prototypes together. Part of my process is the basic stuff like ensuring the colour contrast is okay, but when we hit the browser I think that’s when we should worry about focus states, and when we move to creating content that’s when we worry about create alt text.
  19. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 10:27
    [michiel] caesar: I tend to fail the default focus style because it differs so much between browsers and is usually not visible enough.
  20. [michiel] Or pass it with a note saying “Advised to use custom focus state for better visibility” or something.
  21. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 10:58
    [jv] http://www.wearesigma.com/news/travel-booking-websites-usability-and-accessibility-review/
  22. [karlgroves] @caesar IMO to the extent that you can do better than WCAG, you should, esp. since giving an enhanced focus indication is so easy.
  23. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 11:22
    [michiel] ^ this
  24. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 13:10
    [karlgroves] Fellow a11y friends I'm working on a new talk about JS and accessibility. Care to take a quick survey? https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/B6PKMHB
  25. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Aug 23 13:26
    Does anyone have a checklist of 508/WCAG AA/general a11y stuff that they have available that they hand off to content creators to make sure the stuff they do is accessible. I've been putting something together right now with general stuff I've learned from here but thought someone might have that readily available
  26. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Aug 23 13:51
    Are there ways to include visually hidden text in Flash?
  27. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Aug 23 13:52
    Huh. I have a button with aria-pressed. When it's true, it gets read out as toggle button by VO. When false it gets read out as unchecked, checkbox :-/
  28. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Aug 23 13:57
    VO is interesting, isn't it?
  29. Job van Achterberg
    @jkva
    Aug 23 14:04
    It seems to have to do with DOM manipulation with JS
  30. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 15:10
    [marcysutton] @powersurg it's been years but can you convert the text to outlines?
  31. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Aug 23 15:54
    I have no idea. Sadly one of the major learning management systems course creation software will create things in Flash by default, and has UA detection for android/ios to send them to an html5-version of the software. I'm writing up stuff for them to make sure the courses they create do things in a proper order. They had a deaf user try to take an older course that they didn't have captions on an audio segment (something they've done going for a while but never updated old content) and that sparked the conversation as to what they should be doing. I didn't know if certain things that we normally do for html/js/css/aria was possible in flash components
  32. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 16:06

    [karlgroves] https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/flash

    Depends specifically what you’re looking for. Lots of things available WRT describing objects.

  33. powrsurg
    @powrsurg
    Aug 23 18:00
    OMG this builds things in framesets ...
  34. I went to inspect to see if the title attribute was set and a default language was added. Title on just the parent most one, no language set.
  35. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 18:11
    [juryjowns] VoiceOver Rotor Landmarks
  36. [bmeunier] I'm trying to test for minimum text size in mm on a physical devices and have been using a couple different methods (ruler, digital measurement tools using internet browser). For mobile, I love using http://4ourth.com/TouchTemplate/ … but do you have any suggestions?
  37. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 18:41
    [karlgroves] @juryjowns Got a code example? Can you put it in a gist?
  38. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 19:44
    [juryjowns] @karlgroves Here you go! https://gist.github.com/jeryj/b09dbcff28fdd6e757d1f1c9923d1cf5
  39. [karlgroves] That’s weird
  40. [karlgroves] I’ll check it out further in a bit
  41. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 20:05
    [juryjowns] I thought it was strange too, but I didn’t know if it was actually a bug or if it made sense in some use case I wasn’t aware of. Thanks for looking into it!
  42. [karlgroves] Def. does not make sense. I’d treat it as a VO bug.
  43. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 21:56
    [juryjowns] Thanks for looking into it @karlgroves, it’s very much appreciated!
  44. zakim-robot
    @zakim-robot
    Aug 23 22:37
    [caesar] Love this quote (the first bit) :)
    @caesar IMO to the extent that you can do better than WCAG, you should, esp. since giving an enhanced focus indication is so easy.
  45. [caesar] @powrs, urg - re: checklists, check out https://www.wuhcag.com/wcag-checklist/, http://a11yproject.com/checklist.html and http://accessibility.voxmedia.com/#editorial