Meeting minutes
<Ivan Herman> Date: 2024-10-04
<Wendy Reid> https://
Wendy Reid: reminder to take the TPAC survey
republishing EPUB 3.3
Wendy Reid: need to republish before next work so we have a 'clean slate'
Ivan Herman: Matt has prepared editorial version
… other changes are prepared, awaiting approval, and would replace the existing
… absent comments or objections, we would then republish
… open question about notifying AC about this change
… need a formal resolution from WG to do this
<Wendy Reid> Proposed: Republish EPUB 3.3, EPUB Reading Systems 3.3, and EPUB Accessibility 1.1 as Candidate Amendments
<George Kerscher> +1
<Gregorio Pellegrino> +1
<Rick Johnson> +1
<Ivan Herman> +1
<David Hall> +1
<Wendy Reid> +1
<Ivan Wong> +1
<Avneesh Singh> +1
<Toshiaki Koike> +1
RESOLUTION: Republish EPUB 3.3, EPUB Reading Systems 3.3, and EPUB Accessibility 1.1 as Candidate Amendments
New Charter
Wendy Reid: next topic: new charter
… Ivan working on the contents of the new charter, to represent the discussion from TPAC
<Ivan Herman> PR for new charter
Rick Johnson: I could not remember if part of the new charter discussion and working group is the maintenance of EPUBCheck?
… where does that live now?
Ivan Herman: It's not the responsibility of the WG, we have a formal liaison relationship with the maintainer
… it's not on our charter, and it cannot be
… we did not develop it
Avneesh Singh: EPUBCheck not a part of WG
Avneesh Singh: A little history, we proposed to the former CEO of W3C, why EPUBCheck is not part of PWG because the entire publishing industry depends on EPUBCheck
… he said that the HTML validator is maintained by W3C, CSS, etc
… why not EPUB's
… do we possibly need to discuss this with the new CEO
… if the WG needs to maintain it
Ivan Herman: any software development at W3C requires resources, which are not available
… discussion in past with members considered as creating competition
… talk to Ralph and get advice before talking with Seth
Avneesh Singh: steering committee needs to appoint a new liaison with EPUBCheck
Ivan Herman: WG also has formal liaison
<Ivan Herman> Current new version
Ivan Herman: essential part of new spec is the scope
… two blocks of new features we might want to look at
… reminder of current charter limitations
… discussions from TPAC: webtoons issue (scrolled comics)
… annotations issue to define a standard (referencing Readium work)
… questions about a11y issues with annotations
… 3rd thing: (from breakout meeting) around fxl and spreads
… last item: if web assembly files are allowed in EPUB
… unsure if any a11y changes should be included. Please give comments
… changes could be done by candidate editions, not working draft, pr, cr route
… another block are things we know are subjects of discussions, and may in the future be in final rec
… questions about including or not. Do we commit to producing a recommendation here
… xhtml/html question...
… general a11y issues of graphic novels in general
Hadrien Gardeur: annotations will be in next release of Thorium
… discussion around anchoring back to text
propose to add to list: flow, ability to mix publications
… with spreads problem is not just RS, but also how content is authored
… manga a11y etc. are issues
George Kerscher: 3 things: multiple renditions. Interesting way to address fxl issues by providing an alternative format in the packaged publication
<Avneesh Singh> I think we should incubate on simplifying the mechanism of multiple rendations
Ivan Herman: multiple renditions was part of 3.2, and wg decided to put it into a note as there were no implementations. Core doc gives the hooks to do it, but with no implementations cannot pub into standard
George Kerscher: other 2 items: landscape in Europe with EAA (and US with Title 2) imposing more a11y requirements, suggests we have accessible implementations for the required
Ivan Herman: unsure how to do that. testing phase was feature by feature. lots of work to revisit
… would need similar tests to test a11y, which would require 2 implementations for each feature
… could be a wg issue, but needs input from task force
George Kerscher: some features are 'more tricky' than others. need to identify top issues and test for them
Wendy Reid: need to consider which things we want to do that stay in charter and which push us out
… test suite for EPUB now tests RS rendering, not a11y
… testing RS for a11y means we are testing WCAG
David Hall: mention that fxl is not clearly defined in the spec (comment at TPAC from Brady)
… distinction between webtoons and graphic novels
… would be good to have clear definition of different types
… followup: what are the specific concerns, and what is missing?
Hadrien Gardeur: scrolling widely used, but with flow not commonly used
… multiple renditions: approach was adopted as it was seen as compatible with existing spec
… B&N used it for specific case with newspapers and magazines
Avneesh Singh: trend is keeping incubation away from wg's
… concerned about level of incubation that should be in the charter
… timeframe for finalizing new charter, with pressure coming from a11y legislation, and referencing WCAG 2.0/2.1/2.2
… how to validate what we are wanting to do with the business people so we know we are meeting the needs of the market
Ivan Herman: trying to keep additional incubations small
… wg allowed to think and discuss these
… may be affected by what happenes in the synchronized media group with things like SMIL
… by emphasizing the education market for interchangeable annotations market, need input from that market
… any other item should be justified by market need
… {reviewed the remainder of the charter}
… added optional item if web annotations needs separate doc or update of existing EPUB spec
… looking for consensus if this is the right way to move on. Move to steering committee for comments
… and discussion
… estimate that chartering work will go into early 2025